What's up party people? My name is Sunny Ray. This is the Sunny Ray Show. I've got a really interesting guest. Her name is Shambhavi. I've known her for quite some time. Actually, I'm just going to bring her right on stage. Shambhavi, you're the founder and vision lead for Bitcoin her. How are you today?
I'm great, Sunny. How are you?
I'm great. what year was it that you and I met?
2022. Yeah.
And it was at a meetup, right? That we were hosting, I think, at the Unocoin office. So,.
Yes.
Wow. What's What year is it now? 2026. So, four years in the making.
And I don't know even know where to You know what? Let's kick it off with Bitcoin her. What is it? What is Bitcoin her? Why does it matter? And I guess like what problem are you solving?
That's a great question, and that's the whole premise of Bitcoin her. in India, what I noticed going to all of these Bitcoin gatherings, the Bitcoin only gatherings especially, that female participation remained quite limited. And even though sometimes women did show up, they weren't coming back again. So, what was it? Were they not feeling comfortable in a room full of just men? not having any female other than them in that room. Was that uncomfortable? Was Bitcoin too complicated to understand for them? Was it something else? So, I want to figure that out. And I thought, "Okay, women are smart creatures. They are in the corporate world. They are making a great deal of money. Why are they not understanding Bitcoin?" So, let's do something that suits their vibe. So, I started hosting few luncheons. Luncheon is essentially a kitty party formatted Bitcoin workshop where we have good food. It's a cute place and we learn about why do we need Bitcoin,.
How to buy Bitcoin, how to sell Bitcoin, all over there, and how to self-custody Bitcoin most importantly, the streedhan part. And how to transact in Bitcoin. So, we do all of that in the same workshop. The idea is to encourage female participation in the larger financial landscape in India. but yeah, not just finance, we are Bitcoin. Okay.
You know, I mean, not only is it true that women play an increasingly important role in the workforce, but also in the home. You know, I used to be a financial advisor like, I don't know, I feel like two lifetimes ago or something, maybe three now, but and I noticed a pattern that every home where I mean, this is kind of hard to say cuz I'm a man, but like every home where the wife managed the finances, they fared far better than when the men took control, which is a bit funny to think, right? But but I felt like you know, there's another example Grameen Bank. There's a guy named Muhammad Yunus who's won he's yeah, in Bangladesh. He's won a Nobel Peace Prize.
Around this idea where his bank only offers loans to women. And they found that when they offered loans to women, their return rate was like 99.9 or some crazy percent, whereas the men, they found would, you know, for better or worse, spend it on themselves or do something weird with it and waste it and so yeah, so I think you know, women coming into the Bitcoin space in a bigger way would obviously serve the whole community. So, you found India's the kind of Bitcoin community in 2022, like you said. What was the first room you walked into? Like maybe you talk about that meetup room a little bit and I guess like the bigger question is what did you notice before even anyone spoke?
So, the first room for people working in Bitcoin was definitely the Unocoin office, but the first Bitcoin maxi room was in Goa, which was the halving party in 2024. And it was full of men. I was the only girl sitting across a table of 30 more men. And because it was halving, everybody was waiting for a halving to happen. And there like multiple discussions happening. One of them was, you know, why aren't there more women in Bitcoin? And I think I spent half the night defending my gender as to we are not dumb. We weren't just given the opportunity. So, it's an interesting room of people who see beyond what the world is trying to show us. But yes, half of the perspective from that room is missing right now cuz half of the population is missing.
Who this the word, right? Stree Dhan is the idea the whole thing hangs on, right? So, can you talk a little bit about.
This word for custody and then how did you land on a word that old for a technology this new?
Yeah, that's very interesting. So, I think this comes from the idea of my mom buying Bitcoin before I ever got introduced to this. And Stree Dhan in its core terms essentially means a woman's wealth. And traditionally in India it has been gold. I mean, we all know that Indian women are the biggest holders of gold around the world. And they The idea was to always keep it in your custody. This is your emergency fund. Something goes wrong with your marriage, something goes wrong in your life in general, you always have this gold to back yourself up with. But in today's day and time, when buying gold is another set of challenge, when storing gold is another set of challenge, what is becoming the new Stree Dhan? Are we still inherently believing there's something called Stree Dhan that exists? So, when we spoke about Bitcoin during our luncheons, there was an instant connection when I mentioned the word Stree Dhan. When it used to be gold, and now it can be Bitcoin, something that you pass on to your generations, something that you keep in your custody, something that remains yours no matter what.
Super interesting. so, who told you this I guess was like a bad idea early on, and what was their actual argument?
So, honestly, nobody really told me that it was a bad idea, cuz it's a funny story, you know, the day the idea of Bitcoin was cracked, I was sitting on a table across Harish and Khushbu from Lightning Ventures. So, I was discussing this with Khushbu, how there are limited women in Bitcoin. And I was like, "Oh, Shammi, why don't you just go ahead and do something about it?" Next morning, I created the group. So, imagine very solid veteran from the industry telling me to do that. If there's someone who's telling me to not do it or calling it a bad idea, it would hardly matter, I mean. That's all the validation I needed.
Yeah. And which writers, like books or people, shaped how you explain Bitcoin to someone, you know, hearing it for the first time?
I think Saifedean Ammous, and it was you who encouraged me to read Bitcoin Standard more and more. The idea that goes through money and the problem in the core of an ecosystem, which was constantly manipulated to benefit the powers and not the people, that is something that helps me connect dots for people. I talk about what's happening today with the money, what's happening with our salaries, what's happening with the bank accounts, so all of those things. Additionally, there have been many other books like by Indian writers. There's something called spiritual money by Deepak Kanakaraju, Digital Deepak. Now, he writes about Bitcoin in one of the simplest manners possible. He has spoken about how the banking infrastructure is affecting the money creation, how incidences from history where printing of more money has led to certain depression, certain points in depression, economic depression. So, all of those instances have got kind of helped me enrich my information for the audience.
And like what did you try kind of in the first year that simply, you know, didn't work?
Hm, what didn't work? I think hosting normal meetups online is something that hasn't really worked for me. I feel like women are more social animals or more social beings than most people. So, you know, you call them for a girls' day out, that's a very active participation thing for them. But, if you call them online, most of them would not like to participate as much. So, if you want to educate women about Bitcoin, you better get them out, give them a girls' day.
I think you call it a kitty party or something. I know that's something my mom's like.
Yeah.
Big right? Yeah, And I guess another question is like you teach, you know, self-custody, right? To women who've never held their own money in many instances. So, like what breaks first when they actually try it?
I mean, a lot of times to get them to try themselves, it's a way challenging task because they're scared to do it. and it looks very technical, but if they try it, it's not really technical. So, it's a It's like how you get a vegetarian to eat eggs. It's a mental blocker. Similarly, for self-custody, doing the process is just a mental blocker. My first attempt is to be there with them to help them out with the process. Once they do it on their own, it's pretty chill.
Shameless, you want to say hi to my co-host?
Hi.
This is Daniel.
I love you.
Yeah, so he's also big into self-custody. You've said that the education gap is the real gap, right? So, what does the industry keep doing that essentially widens it?
I think we are looking at two different poles when we talk about Bitcoin education. One is the maxi pole, where we are discarding every other theory that we have you know, we've been brought up with. That is something that makes someone defensive if you start with that in the first go. Second is trying to make people feel that they don't get something at all. We have to start somewhere in between where it's not too maxi or too rejecting of the base ideas that we were grown up with. It has to be accommodative of those ideas. It has to be awareness. It has to be a journey. So, if somebody's taking time to learn about Bitcoin, that patience has to be there. It is a layer just how in marketing we have funnel. It's also a funnel for people to understand Bitcoin. There are stages of it. So, it's important that we do not make them feel unwelcomed just because they don't get it in the first few go. It's important that we make them feel comfortable in an environment where they can ask questions which can feed their curiosity further.
Yeah, that really resonates so I mean obviously as you know I'm very passionate about education as well. So, I guess like running you know events across six cities takes you know real resources, right? So, how is Bitcoin her funded today and like what did that decision cost you?
So, I'm very lucky in the first phase that I got some support from our Indian companies. One of them was Zebpay. Of course, Bitshala. is also where I'm sitting right now. So, they are pro on Bitcoin education, Bitcoin initiatives in India and they try to back every project that is. So, yeah those two and then I had Feddy come up. So, a lot of corporate sponsorships. Alongside that, a few very nice local fellows here who want to support me. So, they just sent they just zapped me some sats. So, luckily yeah that was enough money for phase one.
Good for you. I love that. That's awesome. And I guess like can you give me Bitcoin her in 1 minute? Like who's it for? What do they get? And like what do you kind of like refuse to do?
Bitcoin her is for you if you want to understand what's happening with your money. If it bothers you year on year that you want to buy more things but you end up considering your bank balance and your purchasing power or the fact that something's gotten too expensive for you to buy. If you are thinking about these questions and do not know the answer, Bitcoin her is for you. We discuss these things and something we refuse to do is talk about crypto. We don't talk about crypto, and I also tell you why we don't talk about crypto.
Yeah.
And why we talk about Bitcoin. Yeah, there was one more thing, right, Sunny?
What's that?
You asked me one more thing, right? Yeah.
Yeah, please, yeah. No, I was just laughing cuz like I mean, I feel kind of the same as you know.
So, yeah, Bitcoin is here for you if you're curious about what's happening with your money.
Awesome. And you know, how do the women like who join actually find you, Sunny, and like which route kind of surprised you the most?
So, when I started out this group, I sent the link across to multiple Bitcoin already Bitcoin groups that I already have on my WhatsApp and Signal. Those guys sent it to their wives, their sisters, their friends, their girlfriends, and these were the people who initially joined, and once I think they joined my luncheon, they brought their friends. The friends brought their friends the next time. So, it's like a chain reaction for Bitcoin here.
Oh, I love it. and then you mentioned earlier, right, that you partner with exchanges to run luncheons, and so like who has to agree on your side before a partnership like that goes ahead? Are you running Bitcoin here on your own, or do you have like some people that you're building it with?
So, right now, it's me, and I definitely do have a few Bitcoin here who help me out here and there, but they're not as involved as I am because again, they have their own full-time jobs to take care of. But they try to help out manage schedule and stuff. As far as the decision-making part is, there's definitely a discussion that happens, and then finally, we end up taking one.
And what's the single biggest thing standing between Bitcoin here and let's say 10 times the reach it has today.
I think patience. Definitely a lot of patience because I mean, you have been doing this before anybody ever in India and you know that convincing people or telling people about Bitcoin is not easy. Trust me, your time it was way more difficult. At least in my time it's thanks to all of your work, it's way more easy for me. So, even then today it takes a lot of patience too.
Yeah, it's not easy, that's for sure. the next 90 days, like what are you pushing hardest on and like what would make it, you know, a good quarter for you guys?
So, next 90 days we are starting out our phase two where we're going to be doing 21 cities this time and next 90 days should be covering approximately nine of those cities. And we are doing four events in every cities. Earlier was just luncheons. Now to expand our reach, what we are trying to do is we are trying to host a local SIP and Bitcoin custody sessions which is open to all. A college session again open to all but with more female participation encouraged and the best part of it, a circular economy experimentation. So, that's the most fun part for me cuz when we're going to be going to different cities we'll host crazy events like a half marathon or something and then ask people to pay in sats. So, that's something we're trying to do.
Fun. Wow, I like the creativity. so, I guess 10 years out what would be like does a separate organization for women in Bitcoin still need to exist and like would it and would it mean like I guess what would it mean if if it didn't?
Honestly, I wouldn't want 10 years later a separate organization for women to exist in Bitcoin and that's the prime goal I'm trying to achieve. open doors to the existing Bitcoin community for women. And if it doesn't, that's a win for Bitcoin her.
Awesome. I love it. I mean, you're Yeah, I got to admit, you know, like I'm so proud of you. Like you you've come such a long way. You know, you followed your instincts. You kind of found your own way. You networked. You connected with the right people. You had hard times. You had good times, but you stuck through it. And so, I think that's just so admirable. And you know, I hope my two daughters take a read a page out of your book. You know, I like that your goal is for Bitcoin her to eventually not exist. and you know, that's like really visionary of you. Kambuyi, I'm going to bring this stream to an end. My next guest is here. Thank you so much. I'll have to have you back on again. We should be doing like a part two in the next couple of weeks. But thank you so much. And thank you all for tuning in live. I'm going to bring this stream to an end. Cheers.
